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24th March 2019 at 12:17 am #57049
Exactly, KYC annoys players, the casinos don’t want it. Guess who’s never going to come back to a casino again and deposit and lose all their salary and winnings? Someone who tried to withdraw and couldn’t, that’s who. Casinos want you to be able to withdraw because they know many players are going to redeposit and pump those winnings back in a day or two later. It’s not in their financial interest to try and keep you from doing that.
I mean this post is utter bullshit, just shear incompetence that I have to address it.
Guess what? William Hill bookies will NOT give you the cash that you deposited from your card, never, and they are some off the best financial guys out their who regulate markets all day long, but you know they definitely want you to gamble but will stop you gambling again from your card until the deposits are returned to the card 3/5 working days. But Ladbroke will give you the cash even if it was all deposited from your card, that’s hard cash from 1 bookies but not the other. The rules are the same but I suspect they have different Lawyers & Accountants ?
Good day to you.. ??
124th March 2019 at 12:45 am #57053Struggling to make sense of any of your last five or six posts mate, but so there’s no confusion I’m only talking about online casinos, not high street bookies shops. No idea what rules the latter are subject to in respect of cash withdrawals, but I do know years ago when I was playing FOBTs every shop I played in would give me cash if I deposited cash and pay out to my card if I deposited with a card. But I don’t know what’s an obligation versus company policy on the high street.
24th March 2019 at 2:02 am #57060I wouldn’t go as far as to say they are corrupt i have always get my withdrawals in the end ? but i would agree they can sometimes stall or stretch out the process
I want to say bandit will get his money. Some may say he is being stubborn. I for one think he has given them enough proof that he is indeed him. Let me just emphasise that… I KNOW he has given them way beyond enough to prove he is indeed him.
To reiterate not related to the quote above, the fact that temptation is there and often gets people out, is just a bigger part of the plan as far as I am concerned. This is gambling after all and gambling is by default a willingness to risk loss more than it is to achieve gain.
124th March 2019 at 3:07 am #57063Typically 0.1% interest. So at that rate your funds are earning them all of about 35p per day. There used to be a rule that you didn’t have to pass on interest to clients until it was over about £20 which in your case would take about 8 weeks.12 Apr 2017 solicitors holding money for interest? – MoneySavingExpert.com Forums
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5632904
Assuming it’s the same for any company holding funds, obviously, the more they delay, the better. Sure, silly things to talk about when John want’s to withdraw £24 that he won from a email giving 10 free spins on Starburst.
But what about when millions of people are withdrawing hundreds and thousands….
Seems legit to me.
I have no idea whether casinos are making interest on the money they hold in the client funds account, but if they are it means a £3k withdrawal pending for 3 days (which is way, way longer than average for a withdrawal of that size to be approved) would net the casino a whopping 2.5 pence in interest.
Sorry Argyl I both agree and disagree with some of what you have said but this comment is being slightly obtuse to my mind.
You can’t try to lessen the amount of money the casinos are gaining by quoting figures of 35p a day and 2.5p over 3 days, while ignoring the aggregation principle.
Case in point, if you were to withhold £10,000.000 of withdrawals every day for a year the figure would be more substantial
Now I’m not saying those figures are accurate in anyway, just trying to add some balance to your 3.5p interest comment.
Im pretty sure the casino follow the supermarket principle that every penny counts
And as everyone says, the longer in your online account the more chance you have to lose it. Perhaps an automatic non reversible lockdown by the casinos on all funds as soon as the withdrawal request was made would remove the players view, which is probably correct, that’s it’s just a scummy casino method to try and get there money back.
They would probably get it back anyway eventually, why not show a bit of good faith
124th March 2019 at 7:30 am #57077Cant fucking wait until Argyl gets fucked over by a casino like the rest of us.
I totally agree with what Dune2000 says about casinos controlling and withholding vast amounts of withdrawels. Its obvious why they do it. Dont be a fucking nob and say its cos of regulations. Get a grip of yourself.
Bandit is obviously gonna get his money from Leo Vegas at some point. And the way he’s going off about them being fucking fraudulent cunts is music to my ears. But they are gonna keep doing it no matter how many re tweets he gets lol.
The sad truth is here for all to see. We all know “Even Argyl” knows that the casinos are money driven.
But even after literally hundreds of posts bashing casinos for their cancerous tactics. He wont ever accept that they could be corrupt? It blows my fucking mind that he and a few others have blinkers on.
The pending shit, the KYC shit and the GC shit, are all just clouds of shitty shit, that are put in place for us to get analy raped.
I just wanna grab the shoulders of the sucky suck casino lovers…shake them really hard and scream “Wake The Fuck Up!”
24th March 2019 at 8:06 am #57082Yeah MrB i agree with you there i have no doubt he has sent in all that was requested why wouldn’t he of course he wants the money lol. I think as argyl hasnt had any bad experiences his views are from his own experiences which is fair enough. He is right though as alot of people get these problems through faults of there own for whatever reason by not following terms and what not, of course there is also alot of times when all terms are followed and no document is good enough to get through the process smoothly. I also agree it is on the player not to reverse withdrawals i get how people say the option shouldnt be but there has also been times when i have wanted to reverse and it has already been processed was a pain. So the option itself is not really a problem in my eyes, am not a casino lover either JB not unless they are paying me ?
124th March 2019 at 9:00 am #57091The interest they make does concern me. Dune is spot on here. Over a long period of time the amount accumulated would be a very substantial amount of money.
24th March 2019 at 1:00 pm #57155Sorry Argyl I both agree and disagree with some of what you have said but this comment is being slightly obtuse to my mind.
You can’t try to lessen the amount of money the casinos are gaining by quoting figures of 35p a day and 2.5p over 3 days, while ignoring the aggregation principle.
Case in point, if you were to withhold £10,000.000 of withdrawals every day for a year the figure would be more substantial
Now I’m not saying those figures are accurate in anyway, just trying to add some balance to your 3.5p interest comment.
Im pretty sure the casino follow the supermarket principle that every penny counts
And as everyone says, the longer in your online account the more chance you have to lose it. Perhaps an automatic non reversible lockdown by the casinos on all funds as soon as the withdrawal request was made would remove the players view, which is probably correct, that’s it’s just a scummy casino method to try and get there money back.
They would probably get it back anyway eventually, why not show a bit of good faith
Even on that wild figure though, the interest at a rate of 0.1% would amount to £10k in a year. That’s not a figure any business is going to strategically plan around.
This is all speculation anyway – I don’t know if they are making interest on customer deposits or what even a big name online casino’s typical assets under management figure looks like.
I do think all casinos should have to give you the option to lock withdrawals, either on an individual level or as a setting in your account but it should be an option – you have to remember some people actually want to be able to change their mind and reverse a withdrawal, the fact that many casinos will allow you to reverse is not indicative that they are sitting on your withdrawal requests, hoping you’ll reverse and lose. Casumo for example would regularly take anything from 12-24 hours to process even small withdrawals in my case, even if I’d locked them, whereas other casinos would approve my withdrawals within 5 minutes when I hadn’t locked them and was still actively playing on the site.
A lot of the rules this industry is subject to in respect of carrying out checks on people also apply to the financial industry I work in, so I know what sort of patterns of behaviour with deposits and withdrawals can trigger these delays. I know they seem unfair and annoying to genuine customers but the rules are imposed on us, we are scrupulously audited to ensure we’ve complied with them and the penalties for not being able to show the right paper trail can be punitively immense. So I’m more inclined to believe that’s the reason when someone gets hit by a casino for extra documentation and proof of whatever than that a UK licensed casino deliberately tries to withhold paying a legitimate withdrawal. It’s definitely not something I ever experienced as a player, but you do have to accept if you can afford to deposit £20k in the space of a few hours, you’re going to be asked where that money comes from.
24th March 2019 at 1:22 pm #5716124th March 2019 at 1:53 pm #57164It’s definitely not something I ever experienced as a player, but you do have to accept if you can afford to deposit £20k in the space of a few hours, you’re going to be asked where that money comes from.Again I see where you are coming from, but some of these ID checks do seem somewhat petty and random, In additonl surely a business like this should be able to identify trends.
When someone like Bandit regularly pumps in tens of thousands of pounds, and has made similiar significant withdrawals this does seem a bit of a random trigger. Bottom line is that if you gamble big feel free to deposit but you had better be able to deal with the shit involved in getting your winnings out if you actually win big 🙂
Seems a little one sided to me
24th March 2019 at 2:03 pm #57165I do play at Billy Hill’s and they do have the anti-money-laundering deposit/withdrawal process in place as well as the extended withdrawal times compared to others. It’s a pain when I have a big win on a Friday and have to put a timeout on until Sunday so I don’t get tempted. I do get bombarded with the ‘Responsible Gambling’ rubbish because I do that but, over the last seven years, I am still on at them to introduce withdrawal lockdown (or immediate payout like Sky) or to have the wonderful wagering limits of Videoslots so I don’t roast the winnings back tooo quickly if I get drunk or reckless (or both)
No luck so far. I disagree that they are holding onto cash for interest. More like preying on our gullibility and greed not to reverse. The withdrawal times do reflect the type of deposits though so the above comments about “where does you bankroll come from?” are quite sound. WH delays credit card payments longer than to PayPal or bank account.
They should still KYC before deposits – hurry up with that one UKGC.
24th March 2019 at 2:45 pm #5696424th March 2019 at 2:46 pm #57170Ok so we can argue about rules, regulations or even whether multi million pound business actually only get 0.1% interest on their money, which I doubt.
But the main issue is that they don’t give a crap where the money comes from when you are putting it in, only when they are paying it out.
Its for that reason I doubt their justifications – when the Bandit was pumping 12k into Leo Vegas they didn’t care which card he used, all of a sudden it’s not good enough for a withdrawal?
They juggle the rules to suit themselves as far as I can see and fall back on regulations when it suits them
24th March 2019 at 2:49 pm #57042I had the same trouble with Betfair a while ago. I had deposited thousands using the same bank account but with cards that had been replaced over time and so the last 4 digits of the card numbers had all increased over time. I had made small withdrawals to each card over a period of a few years. When I eventually got a decent sized win of a few grand and tried to withdraw it, they immediately asked for verification of all the ‘old’ cards on the account. I went into my bank in town and got the manager to sign a print out showing all the card numbers that have ever existed on my account, and that was still refused. They actually said that they needed photos of the old cards and that they needed to refund different amounts to various cards to ‘balance out’ the deposits. I knew this would never be possible and went into tilt mode and reversed the withdrawal and lost it in about 10 minutes on roulette which is of course what they wanted. The only casino’s that I trust at the moment are Casumo and BetVictor as I have withdrawn large amounts from them without any issues.
24th March 2019 at 3:08 pm #57180disproportionate spenders – casino operators should obtain information about customers’ financial resources so that they can determine whether customers’ spending is proportionate to their income or wealth
regular customers with changing or unusual spending patterns
proceeds of crime – there is a risk that the money used by a customer has been gained through criminal activity, so greater monitoring of high spenders will help to mitigate the risk
multiple gambling accounts or wallets – customers may open multiple accounts or wallets with an operator in order to obscure their spending levels or to avoid CDD threshold checks
changes to bank accounts – customers may hold a number of bank accounts and change the bank account they use for the remote
casino operatoridentity fraud – details of bank accounts may be stolen and used on remote gambling websites, or stolen identities may be used to open bank accounts or remote gambling accounts
pre-paid cards – these cards pose the same risks as cash, as remote casino operators normally cannot perform the same level of checks on the cards as they can on bank accounts
e-wallets – some e-wallets accept cash on deposit or cryptocurrencies, which pose a higher risk, and some customers may use e-wallets to disguise their gambling
Where a customer is assessed as presenting higher risk, additional information in respect of that customer should be collected. This will help the casino operator judge whether the higher risk that the customer is perceived to present is likely to materialise, and provide
grounds for proportionate and recorded decisions. Such additional information should include an understanding of where the customer’s funds and wealth have come from.Higher risk customers should be subjected to a frequency and depth of scrutiny greater than may be appropriate for lower risk customers.
Regardless of whether they have established a business relationship with the customer, suspect money laundering or terrorist financing, or doubt the veracity or adequacy of documents or information previously obtained for the purposes of identification or verification, casino operators must also apply CDD measures in relation to any transaction that amounts to €2,000 or more, whether the transaction is executed in a single operation or in several operations which appear to be linked.
For the purposes of CDD, ‘verify’ means verifying on the basis of documents or information which, in either case, have been obtained from a reliable source which is independent of the person whose identity is being verified.
This is just a fraction of the applicable regulation we’re talking about.
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